Please tell us what drew you in that you got into making art?

Well… there are some ways that have led me to art. I grew up in East Java, in a town called Tuban. One of my first encounters with art was through my neighbour, Sarekat Sadi. He is a painter; I grew up seeing him working. At times, he would make me pick some paint for him when he was painting. So slowly, it shaped me and my curiosity.

Did your neighbour teach you to paint?

In fact, not at all. He never taught me how to paint. Maybe it was him letting me find my own ways and my own medium. So I was simply being around him; helping him around. Then somehow I picked my own feeling to start making art.

Then, when was it that marked your "beginning" of a career, let’s say?

I think it was when I moved to Yogyakarta. I decided to pursue what I felt. I wanted to study art. However, I could not take art, because an art degree would not take me anywhere according to my parents. So I felt like I was lost. At that time too, I did not feel confident to paint because I could not paint realistically. However, through all that, my friends kept supporting me. Slowly, confidence grew in me. I started believing in myself. So I painted more. It is very important to have people who believe in you.

What was the degree that you took?

I took graphic design. My family had a perspective of not allowing me to seni lukis painting because it was not practical. But I never finished it.

From what I heard, you worked at a hair salon. Could you tell us more about it?

Once, I moved to Lampung from Java. There, I had a friend who owned a hair salon. Because making a living out of art is difficult there, so I took the job. I gave it a try because that was the only opportunity. So I started learning from the capster, then after 2 years, I moved to Jambi to find better opportunities as a capster. Then I moved to Surabaya as a hair stylist. But somehow, I found it difficult as I had to follow what other people wanted. So slowly, I went back to painting.

What does your day to day life look like?

I don’t have a routine, but I need mundane life where I need to work, other than painting or making art. For example, like selling “es” or roti goreng. I do not make them. I pick them up and I go around by motorbike to sell. I need to interact with people. I need to meet people. Through this interaction with kids and adults from many layers of life, I found that spark in me to keep going; including to make art.

You also mentioned that you are now learning ngaji. Please tell us more.

During the pandemic, I did not work at all. I felt a void in me. I longed to see people and talk to them, like when I sell gorengan or es. So during that time, I wanted to pursue my dream of being able to live in a pesantren environment. However, I was going to do a workshop in Jakarta. But I was already in Ponorogo. It was like a coincidence. The workshop was postponed, so I got the chance to stay in Ponorogo. During the time when I was there, I looked around and stayed to learn ngaji in Ponorogo. Now it has been 3 months.

Now that you are expanding to wayang, what moved you to start expanding to wayang?

I think there are some reasons. From childhood memories, like I felt scared when I saw wayang performance as a kid, to the nostalgic feeling of wayang played on a radio by my neighbour. The last reason was when my friend suggested that I just do it. It is a good break in between paintings or drawings. Sometimes it can get monotonous when it comes to drawing. But with wayang, I can paint and cut them. To me, it is another medium. Through wayang, I wanted to tell stories of memories etched onto bodies.

What do you want to tell from the wayang that you create?

I want to deliver stories, to tell people about them. But stories that are shaped from memories that stick into the bodies. I believe that bodies tell stories through pain, wounds, and tattoos.Your body is a library.

How did you create the story?

I created the story from memories. I build them one by one until they become a story. But it does not have to be a full, finished story.

Do you give names to your wayang characters?

I don’t. I let people name them and tell their own stories. So each has evolved, each contains many stories as I pass them around to people.

What would be your next medium?

I’m still exploring and collecting at the moment. I am thinking of slowly moving to installation, but I need more time for that.

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